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25th October 2013
Filed under: Betting — Ben @ 9:18 am

Q: How are you finding it so far?

A: So far I am yet to make up my mind about SportSure.

It’s nice to be able to reach Tony and Pauline easily through the website and the webinars have been reasonably interesting.

Not having the webinar replays is irritating. It’s not as if they haven’t had time to prepare for the course. SportSure was obviously conceived on or before July 2013 when the junk sites began to appear. They really should have made sure all of the webinar features such as live screen sharing and publishing the replays were ready long before Tim Lowe started sending out sales letters.

I’m 50/50 on whether to carry on beyond the first module.

The main gripe I have is the early change to Method 1 – the so-called Early Goal method. This is a method that we were told has been working for two years. One of the two system creators, Tony Langley, even told us that he doubled a £300 bank in one month using the method. And he did this just a couple of months ago.

It’s a little suspicious that this has to be changed so early due to losses that are twice the size that Tony claimed they would be.

[Edited by Ben – 31/10/2013 – benefit of the doubt]

I did put in a request for a download of Tony’s first month’s results to be put in the member’s area in spreadsheet format but Pauline Wheeler-Reid (the other system creator) told me “the video showing Tony doubling his bank is on the website already”.

This would be fine except that the videos on the website are quite useless in their current form. Tony created them by capturing the full screen of his laptop and he has his laptop set at a very high resolution.

Therefore, when these videos are presented in a small box on a website the text on Tony’s screen is far too small to read on the viewer’s screen. Through the SportSure support centre I’ve given them advice on how to fix it but really I should’ve charged for my expertise as, let’s face it, Tim Lowe certainly would have.

Q: Have you put any of the SportSure strategies so far into action and made good profit or see potential for good profit?

A: I have been using the one strategy (the Early Goal method or “9 Minute Profit Plan” as Tim Lowe calls it) but have yet to see any profits after 32 trades. 28 winning trades and 4 losers leaves me down 2.86%.

The winning trades offered small profits but the losers were very big in comparison. Rather than being around 35% of the stake which was Tony’s claim, they actually amounted to over 60% each time.

These big losses took me into negative territory on trade number 3 and I haven’t been able to crawl out since.

My aim on signing up was to make at least £90 profit in the first 30 days in order to cover the first payment. Despite the poor results I still hold some (perhaps naive) hope that this will happen.

Q: As I understand it they will give 1 strategy per month.

A: Yes, it is one strategy per month for as long as you are a SportSure subscriber so if you stay in for the full 12 months you end up with 12 strategies (and spend £1600+).

Q: Will they give live support and show the exact trades they will be doing with results?

A: There is support via the member site and from my limited experiences they are quite quick to answer. I did receive a letter through the post from Markiteer Ltd on Wednesday of this week that told me more about the membership – you can cancel any time and you will still have access to the site until the end of that month’s time i.e. pay on the 1st, cancel on the 2nd and you’ll have access until the 30th.

Not sure about them showing the exact trades they will be doing with results. They haven’t done that so far and they have yet to provide the results of the month’s test that I requested which is very disappointing.

Q: The Google spam as a form of marketing is a bit off putting but it does not necessary negate the fact this could be a good training system.

A: I fully agree that the SportSure Google spam does not mean that the training is bad, it’s simply a daft attempt to try and stop anyone else writing about SportSure and having their opinions read.

[Edited by Ben – 31/10/2013 – benefit of the doubt]

Conclusion:

There’s still some time for the bank to get into profit before the refund window closes.

On the sales page (published on simple-sports-trading-profits.com) Tim Lowe sits on what appears to be his dining room table with Pauline and Tony and states “they really wanted you to be successful early”.

What he is saying is that they picked strategy number 1, the Early Goal method, because it has a high strike rate and should leave subscribers with some early profits.

If I were offering a course where I wanted people to stay for 12 months, I’d definitely offer the best one first to hook people in.

As a SportSure subscriber I really hope this isn’t the best of the 12 strategies.

16 Comments »

  1. I watched the video from Paulines P/L(10 days and 122 markets) and it turned out that over 5k from the 11k profit coming from 2 markets on the same match. That big gamble was shortly before the “proof” 10 days ending and leaving me with the conclusion that it was something like an attack-trade to pimp the P/L.
    That the 9-Minutes-System could fail was almost clear. It needs only 500 of “Tim’s Minions” with 25 quid each for the trades and the liquidity on the Betfair markets can’t fill this anymore. All lumping on in the same minute and all trading out at same time. That was the same with the Lay The Draw system years ago.

    Comment by Catweazle — 25th October 2013 @ 2:59 pm

  2. Hi Catweazle,

    Unfortunately there’s a far worse problem with the Early Goal method that I’ve found.

    I have put a support ticket in to raise it with Tony but there’s an announcement saying that someone in his family has been taken ill so it’ll probably be a while before he answers.

    Let’s just say that the 35% average loss isn’t going to happen. Changes or not, it simply isn’t going to happen.

    Comment by Ben — 25th October 2013 @ 7:41 pm

  3. Thanks for the review Ben. I share many of your concerns. I just checked the site and the previous webinars seem to be available now so at least hopefully that’s sorted. I haven’t watched them yet but will try do so before the next webinar.

    There’s a webinar scheduled for tomorrow Saturday at 26th October 11AM. I will try and attend that if possible. Hopefully we can raise some of our questions and any concerns on there. I only joined the other day and have yet to use method 1 though this evening’s championship game it would have been a winner I guess.

    At least we are able to reach Tony and Pauline to answer any questions. I think being able to ask them ongoing questions and get personal advise on any trading questions will be one of the most valuable aspects of this course as we move on. I have yet to submit a ticket or go through the whole intro videos yet but the layout is easy to navigate and it seems quite informative so far but the proof is in the pudding so to speak. Your experience with Method 1 does not fill me with too much confidence but I know any system is bound to have losing runs. Hopefully it can turn around. I’m sure the other methods may prove more big winners.

    I would prefer more than 1 method per month 2 would be better. Im not quite sure why they are only releasing 1 per month apart from to keep people on the course for as long as possible. In fact Id rather pay more to have the information faster. Like you state if 1 method is not doing so well then at least you can use another method which will give you a good idea of how these systems may work in the long run. Im sure they are not using just 1 method per month, as with any trading it needs a combination of strategies.

    As for staying past the month I would give it a go as I think as the course develops its bound to get better. Maybe I am an optimist but it needs more time. After month 2 if it still seems not to be working out then well that could be the time to exit and you can cancel anytime before the end of the month. I’m ready to give them the chance after the first month‘s payment to see how it goes as its early days yet.
    When put into the context of the full 12month payout of over £1600 + it is an expensive course so we should expect some good results and service. But if they impart the knowledge as promised of advanced trading strategies that produce consistent profits it should more than pay for itself, or I’m sure members will be exiting in droves.

    The intro video of Tim Lowe going on about whingers was a bit OTT. Gave me a feeling he has had quite a lot of issues in the past with unhappy customers. Maybe if there are so many whingers from the past as he states there could maybe shock horror a reason behind this!! Every system can be improved we can follow to the letter the system outlined and if it doesn’t give the results promised it is easy to blame the pupil but maybe it is sometimes the an issue with the system itself.

    The one thing concerning is that the method 1 is being altered already after Tony doubled the bank only a month or 2 back but now all of a sudden he sees some weaknesses in it. But every system can probably be improved and at least it is being addressed. Hopefully this change will be addressed in the upcoming webinar.

    Hopefully the Spam and comments marketing this product does not reflect on any possible fake statements on the course, but I believe the 2 people running this course seem genuine enough and the issues you mentioned can be overcome. I doubt our friend from Urmston has ever considered any charity work if it does not line his pockets.

    I agree with the point of the difficulty in viewing of the videos and text on Tony’s screen. I had trouble reading it too. Hopefully they can fix this and Tony can download the first month’s result as you suggested. That’s not asking much really it would be good to see the exact trades too. That’s what I was hoping for so I may raise this issue too. They say they are going to be transparent about the trading so that’s what they should do.

    As for Pauline’s P/L figures I’ve no doubt she is putting big sums on certain markets. 5K in 1 game profit from 2 markets certainly does “pimp” the figures. But in some ways im not overly concerned about that. She would not have put that huge amount on if she was not sure she had a very good chance of winning. If she can impart even a bit of knowledge about how she did that particular trade then the course is worth its Weight in gold.

    There is still time for your bank to go to profit but the amount of losses should be addressed by the SportsSure team for sure. I will be trying this method on the weekend probably with small stakes and see how it goes. May see you on tomorrow’s webinar if you are there also. Im sure we can get a few questions answered.

    Comment by Austin — 25th October 2013 @ 10:37 pm

  4. That’s right Ben! I think there is only one conclusion for Tonys great results. He let run the trades for much more time than the 9 minutes to top up the profits and/or waits longer to trade out if a trade is hitting by a 2nd goal. Both required a lot of luck and in the long run it ends in disaster. I hope Mr. Lowe can realize this and will pull the plug.
    There wasn’t many possible matches yesterday but the 1.BL-Match in Germany should be another big miss i’m right?

    Comment by Catweazle — 26th October 2013 @ 3:38 am

  5. I couldn’t possibly say whether he let the trades run longer or not. I have asked for the specific details of his one month test but I wasn’t given them.

    Perhaps I should ask again.

    Last night I got 3 trades. 2 winners and one loser.

    In my calculations the loser lost 71.64%. This was using the new method as instructed on Monday.

    If Tony were to calculate the same loss in the same way he did in one of his videos, he would say that it was a 21.49% loss.

    The “wins” managed returns of 2.20% and 7.04%.

    As you can see, in the long term if these figures are typical, this system will only lose money. And that’s even with a 90% strike rate.

    Comment by Ben — 26th October 2013 @ 7:51 am

  6. Hi Austin

    The way that the webinar is set up means that the questions asked by attendees can only be seen by Tony and Pauline (or any other moderators).

    Sadly this means that they could possibly ignore any questions that they don’t wish to answer – not that I’m saying they would but there is no transparency. You could raise concerns on there but if they don’t want anything rocking the boat they might not read your question out.

    You said “I’m sure the other methods may prove more big winners

    Maybe they will but let’s not forget that SportSure will have the most members in Module 1 and then there will be a drop-off every month until the least number of members are still there for module 12.

    Tim will know that he needs to show members some good profits quickly with the first module so he must have picked one of the very best methods for module 1.

    One of the very best methods and it’s not working.

    Tony has potentially made some very dangerous miscalculations in the videos for the Early Goal method and if he can get simple percentage calculations wrong then I can’t continue to believe what he says.

    Austin, and anyone else who has joined SportSure but not started trading yet:

    Please DON’T risk any real money yet – Tony’s calculations almost certainly are completely wrong. Risking money now is foolhardy, please use paper trading only until he explains his 35% average theory.

    Comment by Ben — 26th October 2013 @ 8:15 am

  7. Hi Ben,

    Thanks for the information and heads up how method 1 is going.

    I too have my doubts about how this particular system method 1 works, even with the changes. I’ve no doubt the wins ratio could be accurate but it’s the loss amounts that will wipe it out. I’ve been playing under and over goals market for nearly a year now. I know for a fact if 2 early goals go in within 20 minutes and you are exposed in the under 2.5 market you are looking at 60-70% minimum sometimes 90% loss for a decent amount of time. It’s a bad situation. I’m sure this trend was there last season too, so quite why it wasn’t addressed beforehand is a bit disappointing. As regards the 35% loss even with laying instead of backing as you have proven it is still like 60-70% loss.

    Maybe as suggested losses are reduced by waiting a bit longer. It is possible to reduce the losses by hoping there’s no more goal for another 15- 20 minutes and try exit at a smaller loss but the danger is you could lose your whole stake. Im not convinced about 35% loss like yourself unless Tony is staying in the trade hoping for no more goals till it goes down.

    If you remember the Liverpool Swansea game this season I did pretty much the same as this method and went on under 2.5 goals. The odds of both teams were quite close and fitted the criteria. After 2minutes it was 1-0 so I got in straight after..well after 5 minutes it was 1-1 nitemare!! Thanks Jon Jo Shelvey!! Anyway I was looking at a big loss around 80-90% for a good 10 minutes! so I wanted to wait to get down to around 50-60% down and then The 3rd goal went in around the 35th minute so lost the whole stake. Anyhow since then I’ve been quite wary of unders on certain matches particularly Swansea games!

    Either way its not a good situation. Personally I do use something similar but after an early goal would go onto under 3.5 or even 4.5 if its good odds not under 2.5..and back not lay. Laying may mean less liability if it goes wrong but you do win a fair bit less so id rather back at under 3.5 which may give less odds but adds bit of extra insurance. If the 2nd goal goes in within 9 minutes well you can trade out at much smaller loss. Also I think you do really need Bet Angel for this sort of trading it lets you exit and enter quicker and see the positions much easier. Refreshing constantly on Betfair is a real pain speed is of the essence in these type of trades.

    I am definitely not going to put money on this but paper trade this method for now.

    One time it would have worked. I did similar in the Liverpool and Man Utd game early in the season. Liverpool scored within 5minutes and the game ended 1nil. I went in after crucially on under 3.5 not 2.5 and it was a good win without much worry as had 3 goals insurance. I let that trade run in the end. Even if odds are similar I think added filters need to be in place. I check soccer way.com to see how many goals are scored on average per game each team and when they tend to score.

    Tony does state in the video this method is like just a starter I do believe the next methods will be more advanced and more “exciting” as he puts it but its not been a fortuitous start for sure. Anyway discussing this I dont think we are giving anything anyway as method 1 is more or less explained before sign up.

    I’m definitely we will get more of the “big winner” methods but I can see people leaving as there are issues with method 1 already. This method seems more like an introduction to a simple trading strategy but as presented needs alot more fine tuning.

    I missed today’s webinar. Yes I think it would be good to see everyone’s questions. I certainly hope they don’t ignore valid questions. Everyone whose joined this group I’m certain really wants this to succeed and have spent good money and time on this. They shouldn’t be afraid of any questions or requests for more transparency, if these systems are as full proof as advertised.

    Ill check through the webinar videos later this weekend.

    Lets hope we see some improvements in method 1’s results and that the “exciting” methods to come will start to deliver the big wins..

    Comment by Austin — 26th October 2013 @ 5:58 pm

  8. I am also a subscriber to this trading method. I have been trading for six days including today and I already got in touch with Tony & Pauline as only 2 of my first trades lost and my bank was down 7.72%. The problem is the odds, they hardly move within the time allocated before trading out and I had one trade that was a winning trade that just broke even. On their site they have “recommended” matches to trade on and one of those lost last night (Friday) so that’s 3 out of 18 trades went down and With the average price of the winning trades, it’s very hard to see me clawing back the losses. Tony & Pauline seem like a nice, genuine couple, but I get the feeling they may be busy soon making refunds.

    Comment by Peter — 26th October 2013 @ 6:08 pm

  9. To Catweazle

    I think you’re 100% correct about Tony’s results when you say “he let run the trades for much more time than the 9 minutes to top up the profits“.

    I have asked, again, for Tony’s results in spreadsheet format because although his video is very poor and blurred, I’ve noticed a very dubious trade mixed in with all the tiny wins.

    My bank is now 9.27% down and I have decided to stop trading this Early Goal method until I get some replies from Tony and Pauline in the support centre.

    This is all very disappointing.

    Comment by Ben — 26th October 2013 @ 6:13 pm

  10. Hi Peter,

    Thanks for taking the time to comment.

    I’ve had 6 losing trades out of 37 and I’m 9.27% down.

    I totally agree with you about clawing back any losses – it just isn’t going to happen.

    Comment by Ben — 26th October 2013 @ 10:18 pm

  11. People can only hope that the other systems having a little uniqe component and not all is stolen from other system sellers. The under 2.5 methode comes from Steve Davidson stable and is selling together with 4 other systems as “Soccer Betting HQ”. The videos can be watched here: http://soccerbettinghq.com/system1.htm
    Another possibel source ist “Total Football Trading” with 10 trading systems included.
    Soccer Betting HQ cost £69.95 and the TFT is £77. That seems a cheap investment for Pauline and Tony and of course Tim.

    Comment by Catweazle — 27th October 2013 @ 11:14 am

  12. Hi there,

    Do a Google search on Pauline wheeler Read and make your own mind up about what it says regarding former businesses!!

    As much as you and I want these systems to work the bottom line is that they dont! Not in the way described anyway. (eg a 12 year old could do it) Having said that yes a 12 year old could lose money too. I have not tried this system but have others that did not work from these people and as far as I am concerned they are not what they seem. Stay away.

    Comment by Colin — 27th October 2013 @ 11:55 am

  13. I really can’t find a big enaugh facepalm for Mr.Lowes explanation for changing the rules. Both sides in the over/under markest are equal in the liability/risk ratio. And why the “markets changing” just hours after going publik with this service(and working at least the last 2 years before)? That’s the usual [edited by Ben] for forex sellers but on betting all it’s driving by chance. The other thing would be to know why Tony dosn’t follow the own rules. Closing just the only losing trade to early, just before it happens is very lucky.

    Comment by Catweazle — 30th October 2013 @ 1:28 pm

  14. Hi Catweazle

    It’s difficult to explain my latest support ticket without revealing the Early Goal method on here.

    Basically, using a game from Tuesday night I’ve provided Tony with an example of a trade where using either the original method or the method post-21st October, the losses would’ve been pretty much exactly the same (72.08% or 72.80%).

    Pauline replied this morning to acknowledge it and said she would get back to me later.

    All I can do is wait. Maybe there will be another webinar this weekend but the members site doesn’t have any updates since Friday the 25th.

    On the plus side I did complete two trades yesterday – one 8.16% profit and one break-even. There was a lucky escape too where I was trying to get on a position and the second goal went in before my lay was taken.

    No point updating the site today, I’ll probably do an update over the weekend.

    Comment by Ben — 31st October 2013 @ 11:58 am

  15. any more info on this

    Comment by josh — 6th March 2014 @ 6:19 pm

  16. whats the monthly fee for these systems,you get 1 a month?

    If it’s over 15 quid then your being mugged off,especially if its other peoples system they are using.

    Comment by josh — 6th March 2014 @ 6:23 pm

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